Eric Albright (00:02.471)
Alright, good morning, afternoon, and or good night,
Don't know where you're at, but we're really glad that you joined us here for the Red Letter Leadership Podcast. I'm here today with my good friend from the North, Jordan, who's in the midst of a springtime revival on this, well, for us, it's April 1st in podcast time, in real world time. I don't know when it is that this will go out, but we're fixing to get ready. a couple weeks.
Jordan Ames (00:20.737)
Yeah.
Jordan Ames (00:30.497)
Probably mid to late April, you'll hear us.
Yeah.
Eric Albright (00:36.216)
Yeah, well look, we're prepping for Easter.
And it's right now, it's April 1st. And so this podcast, hopefully for you, isn't a joke because today we're going to be talking about, we're going be in Luke 2 and we're going to be talking not about a parable, Jordan, this isn't a story, this is a real life event. And we're going to be discussing the time in which, this is an interesting one too, it almost sticks out as a standalone in scripture, but this is the time when they, well,
Jordan Ames (00:59.807)
Yeah, this is real interesting.
Eric Albright (01:07.66)
I'm not sure they left him, we'll get into that. But when Jesus was teaching in the temple...
Okay, so we get very few little kind of glimpses into the childhood of Jesus. We got the birth, that's clearly defined and clearly written about, but following the birth until around age 30 or so when he begins his ministry and John the Baptist baptizes him in the River Jordan,
attended there, my good friend, but baptizes him in the river Jordan, we don't really know much about who Jesus is and what he does, except a small glimpse inside of Luke 2 to age 12, Jordan, when he was in the temple teaching.
Jordan Ames (01:40.981)
Yeah
Jordan Ames (01:54.934)
And Luke's the only one that covers this, right? I don't think the other gospel's right on this.
Eric Albright (02:01.966)
I'm not sure, I don't think it's in the other Gospels, I could go look, but I don't think it is either.
Jordan Ames (02:04.725)
I don't, yeah, don't think so.
Eric Albright (02:08.138)
And so this is a really interesting tidbit and they're going down, I think, is for... they went... they're going down for the Feast of the Passover. In fact, that's what it tells us in the first verse. And so why don't I go ahead and read that verse really quick? And so for today on this podcast, the theme of the podcast today is right where I am supposed to be. And the anchor verses are out of Luke 2 and the story with Jesus being left
in the temple or leaving himself in the temple at age 12 we'll see what your take is but it's really it's right where I'm supposed to be and and the takeaway is if somebody somebody were to look in on you today what would they find you doing that's the question and it really comes down to habits okay is really the theory it's in theory what we're going to be kind of spending our time on here today and so I'm going to go quickly read Jordan what why don't you go ahead if you want to read it
Jordan Ames (02:41.051)
Hahaha!
Jordan Ames (02:47.105)
Mm-hmm.
Eric Albright (03:08.042)
Luke 2 starting in verse 41 through the end of that snippet right there if you can.
Jordan Ames (03:13.717)
Yeah, I'll do that. Every year, his parents went to Jerusalem for the feast of the Passover. When he was 12 years old, they went up to the feast, according to the custom. After the feast was over, while his parents were returning home, the boy Jesus stayed behind in Jerusalem, but they were unaware of it. Thinking he was in their company, they traveled on for a day. Then they began looking for him.
among their relatives and friends. When they did not find him, they went back to Jerusalem to look for him. After three days, they found him in the temple courts, sitting among the teachers, listening to them and asking them questions. Everyone who heard him was amazed at his understanding and his answers. When his parents saw him, they were astonished. His mother said to him, son,
Why have you treated us like this? Your father and I have been anxiously searching for you. Then Jesus responds, why were you searching for me? Didn't you know I had to be in my father's house? But they did not understand what he was saying to them. Then he went down to Nazareth with them and was obedient to them. But his mother treasured all these things in her heart. And Jesus grew in wisdom.
and stature, and in favor with God and men.
That's powerful passage there. Yeah. So much fact in.
Eric Albright (04:49.406)
Interesting. Yeah, it's really good. I mean, and so, you know, which version are you reading from? Okay, I have the ESV, which is slightly different, but I don't have a whole bunch of disparities in the two. The gist is this. Well, what's your take, first of all? What is your take on that passage,
Jordan Ames (04:57.121)
NIV. Yeah.
Jordan Ames (05:13.131)
So from a parent's perspective, I'm kind of looking at like trying to find out where was Jesus disobedient? Of course, we know he was not. But I'm trying to think of, OK, so if he wasn't, then where can I find where he wasn't disobedient?
Eric Albright (05:18.296)
You
Jordan Ames (05:38.451)
And so I guess the assumption is that he's in, he departs with them. Joseph, as the father, as the leader of his household, he did not do a head count.
Eric Albright (05:54.254)
Bad head count. Hey, we lost a chicken one night because of a bad head count.
Jordan Ames (05:55.232)
He, he,
Eric Albright (06:03.846)
yeah.
Eric Albright (06:15.948)
Yeah, that's interesting.
Jordan Ames (06:24.043)
man, we haven't seen Jesus. Like, he's probably with some relatives and friends, but we should confirm that, right? Great, after a day, you want to confirm you have everybody. And they're looking, they don't see him. So then they spend a day going back to Jerusalem, and then they're looking for him for three days in Jerusalem. Jerusalem is, of course, big nowadays. You have the old city, but then you have all the new stuff. Back then,
Eric Albright (06:32.899)
Yeah.
Jordan Ames (06:53.865)
It wasn't even as big as the walled city is now. So I can't imagine you're, like where were you looking for three days? But they find them in the temple.
Eric Albright (07:02.018)
Yeah. Yeah.
Right.
Jordan Ames (07:07.745)
Which is incredible and then what's awesome is that
he was found, it was in verse 46, sitting among the teachers. He was listening and he was asking them questions. And of course, it says later on that they were astonished. His parents were astonished and that everyone who heard him were amazed, right? So, and it says they were amazed at his answers. So clearly, he was asking questions, but they're also asking questions of him.
And he was providing answers.
Eric Albright (07:51.278)
Yeah, I've got a few takes on this. Number one, have you ever looked at the old, well, from Jesus's time, the routes, roads, and maps?
Jordan Ames (07:53.077)
Yeah, yeah, go ahead.
Jordan Ames (08:08.021)
No, I don't think so. The only maps I've really looked at are just like the probably the more ancient ones or like Paul's journeys type of thing.
Eric Albright (08:09.528)
Yeah.
Eric Albright (08:15.982)
Yeah, if you want to have a fun, you know, depends on your version of fun, but a fun Saturday morning over a coffee, go and start pulling some of those up on Google or if you got like a study Bible or something, and you're going to see real quick that the roads in and around the time, you're starting to look at like amount of miles and days travel, you know, because it's an incredibly insightful and I would say...
It really adds a lot of substance to your study. So up north you've got, you know, the Sea of Galilee runs down the Jordan River into the Dead Sea, right? But that's where the Sea of Galilee is where most of Capernaum, the tombs on the south side, where he casts out the demons.
ran the pigs off the cliff right around there. And so there's a lot of teaching that happened there. But Jerusalem isn't up there. Jerusalem's further south. And so they had to actually travel the Jordan River Valley down south. And then they would go up. They would call it up, you know, into Jerusalem because it's up on the plateau or the mountain again. And in between there...
Jordan Ames (09:18.741)
Yeah, it's in the central highland of Israel.
Eric Albright (09:21.184)
Yeah, and in between there was what they called Samaria, right? That's John 4, woman at the well. They were traveling one way or the other and they took a turn, I think they're coming from, a left turn up into Samaria. adds more later on, more power to that scripture. And that talk, he left the beaten path to go find that woman at 12 noon. Long story. We talked about that last time, I think. Or maybe that was in the other podcast. I'm not sure. that was another point. But look at your geography. Because you don't just...
walked everywhere like they're not getting they're not riding horses riding cars obviously or nothing like they're walking back from the temple from the Passover just a simple fact that they were committed because you feast of the Passover told be just I'm gonna go for a what's the last time you went for a three or four day walk on your own because you wanted to and then brought your whole family and the kids and everybody so that whole event in itself was a significant emotional event and you know their dedication is is is admirable
But number one, that's number one. Number two, and I didn't really, I don't think this ever jumped out to me until you just mentioned it, after three days they found him in the temple.
three days, accident or not accident.
Jordan Ames (10:35.272)
days.
Yeah, especially it's the feast of the Passover and of course what our listeners are going to hear this, you know a couple weeks after Easter but We're celebrating the Passover this Friday Thursday Friday and then Easter on
Sunday. But yeah, three days.
Eric Albright (10:56.062)
After three, let's just say this out loud together, independent of Luke 2, after three days, they saw him.
Jordan Ames (11:05.717)
Amen. Wow. Yeah.
Eric Albright (11:07.224)
How about it? There's, I mean, your options are coincidence or not. There's no in-between. Correct. They found him after three days. Well, after three days they found, you know, the only difference is they found an empty tomb, but he showed himself in the upper room. Remember that?
Jordan Ames (11:11.849)
They found him. Wow.
Jordan Ames (11:24.993)
Yeah.
Eric Albright (11:25.646)
Pretty crazy, J.O.F. Jordan, pretty crazy. Your options are, it is A, a coincidence, or B, it isn't. Pick one. And I generally, when Jesus is involved, I tend to never pick coincidence. You know?
Jordan Ames (11:32.363)
You
Jordan Ames (11:37.735)
Right, yeah. Is there a coincidence that he didn't tell them what he was going to be doing? Well, of course not, because they would know you're coming with us, right? And then this story would have never happened.
Eric Albright (11:55.736)
Yeah, and this is just so interesting. And here's another thing.
Jordan Ames (12:00.833)
And I also love how Mary says, well, it's recorded in verse 51, but his mother treasured all these things in her heart. Like, we are only getting such a snippet of the full story here. Now, we know Luke is a historian, so he's writing this based on the interviews that he did with people that know of this story, right? Maybe he talked with Jesus' mom.
Eric Albright (12:28.226)
Yeah.
Jordan Ames (12:29.599)
and got the snippets of it, maybe he talked with Joseph. But Luke's writing, like, to our knowledge, Luke never knew Jesus, or maybe he just wasn't close to Jesus.
Eric Albright (12:40.674)
yeah well Luke's Peter's guy so Luke wrote for Peter correction that's Luke's Paul's guy yeah Luke's Paul's guy so this is Luke's Paul's guy Luke was absolutely a physician yep he's the historian
Jordan Ames (12:47.329)
No, that's Mark.
Yeah, yeah, Luke. So Luke was a doctor and he wrote the book of Acts, right? So he's like the historian. He wrote, I think he even calls himself a historian, either the beginning of Luke or beginning of Acts, but he recorded, he's a historian. He records what events that happened and that's.
Eric Albright (13:07.634)
he traveled with Paul so a lot of this is Paul's account to some degree or Paul's influence for sure.
Jordan Ames (13:12.289)
Yeah, that could be. But I'm sure he investigated. Because I think he says that at the beginning of Luke. Yeah, so he says, Luke 1, verse 3, therefore, since I myself have carefully investigated everything from the beginning, it seemed good also to me to write an orderly account for you. And he's writing to this guy, you, most excellent theophilist.
Eric Albright (13:16.994)
But Paul didn't know this stuff because he didn't travel with. Yeah. Let me go back.
Eric Albright (13:38.242)
the apples.
Jordan Ames (13:40.32)
so that you may know the certainty of the things you have been taught. So anyway, so we get this story in Luke, whereas the other gospels were probably more eyewitness accounts. Luke's more of a secondhand account. And we probably get this story because Luke was talking to people. He was interviewing people. And he thought that this
Eric Albright (13:45.806)
interesting.
Eric Albright (13:58.36)
Correct. Marks a secondhand account.
Jordan Ames (14:07.455)
was an important thing to put in there, right? This account of boy Jesus, 12 years old. And why is it important? Because what other 12 year old at that time is doing something like this? Especially if his mother's treasuring him.
Eric Albright (14:13.314)
The only one.
Eric Albright (14:20.238)
Well, here's the... have you ever looked... Yes, and that's the good point. That's where you kind of started there. Because we know that Mary was... she knew... I mean, she knew she was immaculate conception, right? She knew it. The angel visited her. Like, you have a son. You're going to call in Jesus. All right? Just be prepped. You're in your prep time. He's the son of God. Like, oh great. What's that going to be like? You know? You know? Yeah.
Jordan Ames (14:43.457)
I'm gonna screw this up. No, you're not God's with you. It'll be good. You'll be a good mom Yeah, right, I just left them in Jerusalem like what
Eric Albright (14:47.956)
I just left him in Nazareth! That's the Son of God! I blew it! The world's doomed! man, anyhow, so, well here's another thing, and so they left him, they found him teaching, but, you know, Jesus's posture is what you mentioned earlier.
Sitting among the teachers listening to them and asking them questions. Holy cow talk about the son of God all God all man He's like no I'm gonna ask you some questions. They didn't say if it was he was doing like parables Let me ask you some questions like that, right? It came off as or how it came off. He made I think he probably was that's how he spoke, bro
Jordan Ames (15:23.337)
Right. He may have been. He may have been doing better. He probably was. Yeah.
Eric Albright (15:30.094)
Let me ask you this teacher and it's coming from a 12 year old they didn't see it as a challenge to them. They saw it as inquisitive which then they said they're amazed at his understanding and his answers like whoa this guy's challenging and he's got some good questions. But you know where was he at because if you ever look at like how the temple was set up. So you had like you know the.
Jordan Ames (15:51.834)
not, not close enough. I've just read through.
Eric Albright (15:55.822)
You had the temple court where they did all the sales, which Jesus in John's gospel flipped the tables. That was in the court, the entry court, where any Gentile or Jew can go. then you had where only Jews... So we're doc, it's centric out to end for the temple. I could show you a map, but I don't have it with me. Actually, I do have a map. It's right here.
Jordan Ames (16:22.229)
While you're looking for that, was just thinking of like, he's questioning these teachers. In that culture, in first century.
Eric Albright (16:33.58)
See it.
Jordan Ames (16:34.721)
Like it's not, yeah, it's not, it's not like socially acceptable to question the religious leaders. Like the religious leaders are, we'll give you what the law says. We'll teach you, you don't teach us. You know what I mean? And here Jesus is like asking questions. He's probably asked, doing some critical thinking, right? Which is like a big no-no in that.
Eric Albright (16:48.472)
Okay. Yeah, right. That's correct. And we learn this later.
And you remember the...
Yeah.
Yep, you aren't allowed to do that, because yeah, exactly right. He lambasts, I think it's in Matthew 22, he lambasts these Pharisees, man. He's like, they walk around in their flowing robes and their fancy tassels and then goofy things where they keep their scriptures. I can't remember the name of it. You know, trying to brag about who they are. And all they are is, what do you say, an empty tomb. There's just an empty tomb.
Jordan Ames (17:04.831)
in that culture.
Jordan Ames (17:23.979)
Yeah, right.
Jordan Ames (17:29.365)
They call them brood of vipers at times.
Eric Albright (17:32.182)
all over, many, multiple times. So you had the temple, you had where they did business, which he didn't like, his father's house, right, they desecrated it, they flipped the tables. And then as you go in, you had, you know, the court of the women, where Jews, men and women, only Jews could go, and then you had where only Jewish men could go, and then you had where only Jewish men that were priests could go, and then you had only Jewish men that were the high priests, and then you had the highest of, the highest of high priests, the most high.
And then you know the the innermost chamber where they had the Ark of the Covenant and they sacrifices once a year etc. like my question is where was he at? know was he where in the temple in that little concentrical hierarchy did like you come with me young lad we've got some questions because you you wouldn't have thought Okay Yeah, okay
Jordan Ames (18:21.215)
Yeah. Well, my version says temple courts. So I'm assuming there's more of like the social area. You like you use that in the outskirts.
Eric Albright (18:31.478)
Yeah, that would make sense. That's one of the areas. That's the first one. Well, there also is like the... Go ahead.
Jordan Ames (18:32.821)
Yeah, sitting among teachers, listening to them. Because again, it's
I mean, it could have been too far in if his parents found him. Maybe it was like the Jews only place you mentioned. Other than that, it wouldn't have been much further.
Eric Albright (18:45.325)
No.
Eric Albright (18:49.69)
Yeah, well there's a court of the women, it could have been there, it could have been in like the open court out front, it could have been in any of those places. It's just interesting, I mean as you break this down. But here's the question, so this is a leadership podcast and I have two good, two points, two points for us. Number one, the first point is,
What's the, how about the implication in whenever, you know, Jesus will always be right where he's supposed to be. you could, Mary and family are absolutely indicative of us, in which if we want to find him, the only thing we gotta do is turn around. Right? We often wander off and we leave him there. And he doesn't go anywhere. He's always there.
You turn around and he'll be right there waiting where you left him. He's not gonna wander off.
Jordan Ames (19:41.122)
I'm thinking of that poem, the footsteps in the sand, where it's like there was times that Jesus carried us. And I think sometimes, I just shared with my church family this past Sunday during a prayer and praise thing, I was just sharing how I was able to go down to North Carolina two weekends ago.
Eric Albright (19:47.022)
Sure.
Jordan Ames (20:06.625)
And for a retirement ceremony and it was great reconnecting with guys I've been seeing in over a decade and just getting into faith talks with them and stuff and seeing how Lord is moving in their lives. it just really literally hit me how like even how we may have planted a seed and we're not sure how the Lord is still working, whether we're a part of it or not. And so with what you were just sharing with like
Yeah, just turn around. That's where he is. He's closer to us. We're the ones not turning to him. And I thought of that, footsteps in the sand. Yeah. And he's so gracious that there's times we don't know it, but he's carrying us. He's that close. I mean, it's incredible to think about.
Eric Albright (20:43.17)
That's correct. He didn't leave us. They left him. We leave him. He doesn't leave us.
Eric Albright (20:57.422)
Yeah, great point. And are we gonna let him carry us? Are we like, no, I got it, I can cross this. Like, bro, I can literally just carry you, you know? I can get you through this.
Jordan Ames (21:09.569)
But he's so gracious, he'll do it anyways when we don't even know it. And he'll set us down in a better position and we won't praise him for it, because we don't know he just did that.
Eric Albright (21:14.242)
Yeah.
Eric Albright (21:20.171)
unrecognized.
Jordan Ames (21:21.377)
You know, just think of like the natural stuff like how you were just almost in a car accident. I'm not saying you were, I'm just hypothetical. Like, we're just almost in a car accident. Do we immediately say, thank you, Jesus? Maybe I made the mistake and could have caused it. Or any, like there's so many things that we miss that we'll never know until we get to heaven on where he was actually carrying us. Yeah.
Eric Albright (21:46.508)
Yeah, that'll be revealing. Here's, that's good. And so the point number one is if you think that he's left, he hasn't. And if you want to find him, just turn around. You know, it's that simple. He would be right there where you left him. And he may just, and actually when you go to turn around, he may be standing right beside you the whole time. And you didn't realize it to your point, Jordan.
Jordan Ames (21:57.58)
Yeah.
Jordan Ames (22:06.977)
But honestly, that's what this whole podcast and our book is all about. It's just to grow people closer to the savior. And from our perspective, the value we want to deliver is to use that growth closer to the savior to help make you a better leader in your family, your work. Yeah.
Eric Albright (22:23.532)
That's exactly right. Well, that's the next point. Good segue. This is the takeaway, the leadership takeaway. We can spend the last 10 minutes, 5-10 minutes on this. It's habits, okay? So, if Jesus were to drop in on you today, or anybody, if anybody were to drop in on you today at any random time, what would they find you doing?
Jordan Ames (22:28.01)
Yeah, let's go.
Eric Albright (22:50.272)
Right? For Jesus, His was, they found Him teaching or asking questions or with the teachers in the temple right where He was supposed to be. But for us...
would it be the same case? know? then would it... There's a lot of things and lot of vices that, you know, men and women get into every day or daily basis. Call it on your phones, call it conversations. If someone were to pick... And I think there's even some goofy social media app that's like, take a snapshot at random times throughout the day when we say, because people can see what you're up to. It's the dumbest thing, man. I don't know if it ever caught on, but it's the dumbest thing. But...
Jordan Ames (23:24.043)
So dumb.
Eric Albright (23:27.854)
Somebody did that if somebody had an app and they were you were required to take a snapshot of exactly what was happening that moment What would they find you doing and that's and that's the leadership takeaway here? so You said is for your subordinates when they drop in your office when they drop when they come and ask you for business What do they find you doing? Are you working? Are you screwing around on your phone? Are you they're willing to offer them? Excuse me guidance wisdom and advice
Are you doing that for somebody else? Or are you doing things you might not be proud of if you had to write home and tell mom about? That's the question. Or if your boss found you doing it.
Jordan Ames (24:03.957)
Yeah. That's so good. When I look at the title of this lesson, and you wrote this one, right, Eric, in the book? You wrote this one? I think so. So write what I'm supposed to be. I think of your typical personal growth leadership development topic of purpose, identity. We can get those lessons out of here. And I think you did pull out some of those.
Eric Albright (24:15.117)
I did.
Jordan Ames (24:33.473)
But I love the angle you just brought to it. Like, if Jesus shows up right this very second, where are you? Are you doing, are you fulfilling that assignment that he's given you? That God has placed you on this earth to fulfill. That's more of a macro strategic way to look at it. But there's also the, like Snapchat or, I think it's Snapchat.
when you look at it, like this moment in time, what am I doing right now? And I think, yes, we need to be working. I'm bad with busy work. Sometimes I get caught up in just busy work that's actually not moving the needle for something. That could be for my family. I I've failed at times with that. It could be for work, whatever.
Eric Albright (25:03.786)
is the chat, snapgram, yeah.
Jordan Ames (25:34.284)
But I also think when we're talking about if Jesus is showing up in our life at a specific moment in time, I think another question is when comes to where are we supposed to be, what are we doing, what's the posture of our heart at that moment? Like when you just got a, when you just got a, you just, you're in the middle of gossiping about somebody. You could be completely accurate, right?
Eric Albright (25:50.508)
Yeah, that's the one I was going to finish off with.
Eric Albright (25:59.084)
Yeah, valid.
Jordan Ames (26:03.167)
Like what do you, what does Jesus want you to do about what you're gossiping about? Does he want you to just keep gossiping about it? Or does he want you to maybe find a solution in how you can love the person you're gossiping about rather than talk about them, you know, to somebody else? Like what's the posture of the heart? That's convicting.
Eric Albright (26:18.114)
Yeah, you're right. Yeah, and that's it.
Yeah, that's super convicting. people are going to say, what's the so what or what's the how to? And the how to is simply this. This goes back to this. You're going to sin. You're going to make mistakes. You're going to do things you shouldn't do. We're human beings. You're not going to be perfect. Don't try to be. It's just going to send you to the grave. So don't try to be perfect. But here's the thing. But what you can attempt to live out are the fruits of the spiritual. And so if they find you doing something that embodies, and this is posture of the heart, it's something that embodies some
one of the nine as in Galatians, fruit of the spirit, I don't think you can be wrong about that. that goes, know, love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, self-control. Against such things, there's no law. If you can, they find you embodying those in the moment, call that a win.
And it doesn't matter what it is that you're doing in that moment, you're having a conversation with somebody who needs you or you're telling somebody what they did wrong in the last meeting or over the last week. Are you providing a debrief or a tough debrief? But you can give a tough debrief. Paul says, speak truth and love. You give a tough debrief by using one of those. You can speak the truth and love, man. Love with joy, with peace. You can be with self-control. You can even use the fruits of the spirit.
when you're telling somebody something that's uncomfortable. These don't just shut off. It's really a mindset and you hit it. It's a heart posture. And that doesn't just change overnight, that changes over time. The circumcision of the heart is your old hard heart, hard self. You're slowly being transformed into being more Christ-like. That's... What's word Jordan? Justification.
Eric Albright (28:09.686)
and then glorification, sanctification! Go to Romans. That's the sanctification process over time, It's not a light switch. It's more of a rheostat. It just turns up over time.
Jordan Ames (28:15.617)
Yeah.
Jordan Ames (28:24.193)
And that's such an anti-thesis, I guess, for our current culture. We want what we want. We want it right now. Even if we truly want the leadership development and personal development, we might recognize that, yeah, it takes a long time. But still,
We're so consumed by the consumerism society we live in. We're consumed by the, I can just hop on Amazon and get what I want. I can just take a loan out if I don't have the money and get what I want. Like, whatever I want, I can get it. And so it's backwards when it comes to a heart change, when it comes to personal development. Like, we have to truly be very intentional about wanting that growth.
and wanting to improve in those areas. And it's hard, man, it's so hard. Yeah, habits. Yeah, discipline habits.
Eric Albright (29:24.93)
Yeah. Habits. Habits. That's what this was originally about. you doing what you are supposed to be doing, what they expect you to be doing, or what they expect of a Christian. If somebody were to accuse us of being Christians, would it be enough evidence to prove us guilty? Right? Like, do we have like steady habits in the morning? How are we starting our day? How do we behave ourselves in the office? How do we be, you know, what are the things we do when no one's watching? You know, in our alone time, we call it whatever.
Jordan Ames (29:42.101)
Yeah.
Eric Albright (29:56.044)
Like those are all things that those are habits Jordan like how are we going about our day from moment to moment right and what they're gonna find is teaching and asking questions and in the temple or they're gonna find us doing something that we might be a little bit more embarrassed about and that's a real question.
Jordan Ames (30:10.909)
And Jesus addresses that, I don't remember where in the gospels, but he mentions that many will call him Lord, Lord, and he'll say he never knew them.
Eric Albright (30:24.726)
and i never knew you and i guess in math 24 something around there that's up here yeah pretty sure it is
Jordan Ames (30:27.371)
Is that Matthew? Man, that's, and then Paul talks about in, I want to say, geez, I could be getting this.
Eric Albright (30:34.016)
It's the most terrifying verse in scripture.
Jordan Ames (30:37.313)
The Lord, Lord one? Yeah. Paul mentions, I want to say it's Philippians, but he mentions that we must work out our salvation with fear and trembling. Like that verse from Jesus saying, many will say, Lord, Lord, I want out of your kingdom, whatever the verse. And he'll say, go away from me. I never knew you. And I want to be like, hold up. Am I living a life that I? Is it in the sermon or not?
Eric Albright (30:39.308)
Yeah.
Eric Albright (31:01.142)
What? Sermon on the Mount. Matthew 7. Yeah.
Jordan Ames (31:07.603)
Okay. Yeah, that should call everybody to do a self audit.
Eric Albright (31:10.222)
That was somewhere.
Eric Albright (31:14.508)
Yeah, self-audit. Well, that's the thing you said about like this is the opposite of what society would have you do today because it's an instant gratification type of society. So in a world where being counter-cultural is cool, remember that? Jesus is counter-cultural. So how about you do that and be cool? There's your counter-cultural lesson. You want to be cool and counter-cultural? Be a Christian. They're very counter-cultural.
Jordan Ames (31:15.817)
Again, it starts with the heart.
Eric Albright (31:40.8)
It's against everything society is telling you today. It's finally... We figured it out, Jordan. It's finally cool to be a Christian again. Imagine that.
Jordan Ames (31:52.072)
Yeah.
Eric Albright (31:53.934)
Maybe that's where this revival is coming from. Because I know, I mean, we're in one. We're in a fight, by the way. But I also see revival coming. He's not going to just let his church be overtaken.
Jordan Ames (32:04.257)
But I think you're right. And we're in a fight because there's revival coming. The enemy doesn't want that. I say it a lot. I'm sure you've heard me. The American church is comfortable. And I say that generally speaking at large. Many churches are doing awesome things. They're not comfortable. They're pursuing God-given direction.
Eric Albright (32:13.282)
Just this week. I love it, man. Just this week.
Jordan Ames (32:30.677)
They are addressing the opposition and challenges that present them the right way, the way Jesus would address opposition, which we write a lot about in her book. But there's many churches that are just like, hold up, conflict, challenges, opposition? No, I think we're good where we're at. We'll just keep doing the typical stuff. We'll just keep having the ministry program that we have that really hasn't moved the needle for anybody.
Eric Albright (32:50.488)
George, are... I agree.
Jordan Ames (32:58.625)
It checks the box on, we have a Sunday school, we have a Wednesday meeting, have whatever. You know what I mean? And yeah, it really ties into the Church of Latter-day Sea of being lukewarm. Like, why were they lukewarm? Well, because they had booming finances, they had a booming textile industry. I think they had some medical advancements and stuff. And I was reading some of that in my footnotes. I'm like, man, it sounds a lot like America.
Eric Albright (33:04.856)
Hell yeah.
Eric Albright (33:27.95)
We are one piece of legislation away from a fight that people aren't prepped for and what do I mean by that? Look at Canada just this week. They outlawed Christian or biblical references and are now labeled as hate speech. Bro, and did you see that? Yeah, I don't know if it was a bill that was passed, but it was most certainly introduced that
Jordan Ames (33:43.723)
Wow.
Jordan Ames (33:47.487)
No, I didn't. Nope.
Eric Albright (33:54.068)
Anything that references the Bible is considered hate speech or can be considered hate speech. I just deliver hand deliver it think it'd work out Yeah, but so yeah, we are one Dude yeah, that's right, but sorry tell send me back to America. I'll be it'll be terrible. I'll hate it
Jordan Ames (33:57.196)
I think we should mail one of our books to the prime minister's office.
Deliver it. Yeah, we're gonna do deport you
Jordan Ames (34:13.342)
Send me back.
Eric Albright (34:15.63)
Yeah, but we're one piece of legislation and one senator or congressman from introducing something that's going to put us in a fight for everything we believe in. And I don't know if we're ready for that. This isn't a podcast about that, but I don't know if we're ready for that.
Jordan Ames (34:21.889)
Yeah, you're so right, You're so right.
Jordan Ames (34:31.745)
At large, I don't think we are. mean, I think COVID was probably a test. know, some churches folded. I don't mean if you closed your doors, you folded.
Eric Albright (34:35.212)
I don't think we are, so.
Eric Albright (34:49.42)
like don't exist anymore. Folded.
Jordan Ames (34:51.797)
Yeah, so I'm just saying folded like like spiritually like they put These certain demands of kovat ahead of their spiritual practice. I'll say what I mean is I came back from Afghanistan March 19th of 2020 and You know, there was like I was told that grocery stores might be closing I was I'm like what what is going on? know, like you know how it feels like you come back from being gone six months and like
Eric Albright (35:16.8)
Hmm
Yeah.
Jordan Ames (35:21.501)
Even if everything was good, you still have to kind of assimilate. we'll pick up where we left off, whatever. I come back and everything's chaotic. And I'm hearing all this like, yeah, six feet apart, stay away, closed, shut down, school, of course, is shut down by then, like all this stuff. I was like, I told my wife, we had conversation. was like, the Bible, the biggest theme for the Bible was relationships from Genesis 1 to Revelations, first with God.
second with man. That's the main thing. And I said, they're trying to divide. They're trying to get in and say, we can't have a close relationship because you might die. I was like, I'm not. I am going to have strong relationships for my kids, for myself. We're not going to let this situation destroy our relationships. And certainly, you know.
Eric Albright (35:51.928)
Bingo. What do mean, theme? That's what we're built for. That's literally what we are built for.
Jordan Ames (36:19.199)
Virtual means help with things, that's not, you can't just, in the COVID instance, you can't just, we'll keep contact virtually. No, it's only a couple weeks till people start losing their minds. And my kids, at the time, my youngest was three, right? Now you know, she's going to be in person with other kids. And yeah, we did that. We went over, we hung out.
Eric Albright (36:43.374)
Yeah, we're happy to assume that risk is her parents. This is insanity. Yeah, and so that's it Jordan. That was a proof right there. You're feeling familial leadership. If Jesus came back and found you, he would have found you upholding the gospel ideas it seems like, which is awesome.
And that's kind of what we're talking about us. I'm gonna wrap this up, but that's what we're talking about today It's like given a moment in a snapshot in time and and you don't get to pick it somebody else does What would what would?
Jordan Ames (37:11.081)
Right, right, of course not.
Eric Albright (37:13.634)
What would they find you doing? And to some of us, or I would say most of us, that's a scary proposition. And so it's just, you know, this is just a shot across the bow for all of us to just have a think about what your habits look like on a daily basis. In the home, out of the home, it doesn't matter when. As a church body, it doesn't matter. Just have a thought because, you know, Jesus, when they went back and looked for him, they found, number one, all they had to do to find him was turn around. And number two, when they found him, he was exactly where he was supposed to be.
teaching, learning, and the temple. And so that's challenge for you today. That's it. If someone's going to come in and drop in on your life at a point of their choosing, what are they going to find you doing? And that's the question we will leave you with today. So thanks for joining us on today's Red Letter Leadership podcast. Jordan and I are happy to have you in. We kind of jumped on this thing right quick at the end. We're both doing some other work things today. And this is a little bit of a riff, Jordan, but what do you got? Close us out, buddy.
Jordan Ames (38:10.741)
yeah, it was good. I think you close this out perfectly. That is the challenge. If Jesus shows up at any time, are you doing what you're supposed to be doing? And I encourage the listeners to interpret that question, because it's going to fit differently. Some of them, like I mentioned before, it's going to be an answer to the macro.
type of like, am I living the assignment God has me living? And some of them are just going to be like, am I speaking to my wife the way I should be speaking? Am I speaking to my children the way I should be speaking? Yeah, so for the listeners, interpret that how you will. But that's a great, great question that you pose there,
Eric Albright (39:00.078)
Well, as we finish up, you can find us on social media, Facebook, Red Letter Leadership, search us on there, redletterleadership.com. You can get us on LinkedIn, again, Red Letter Leadership. If you want, can go on Amazon and get the book. That's what we're teaching out. These podcast lessons come from this book. This one came from...
page if you have the book it came from page 261 and it was titled right where I'm supposed to be so come get the book if you're interested follow along with this but hey thanks for joining us and we'll see you again next time on the red letter leadership podcast
